美国国家公共电台 NPR Special Counsel Says Paul Manafort 'Breached' Plea Deal, Lied to FBI

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DAVID GREENE, HOST:

President Trump¹'s former campaign chairman Paul Manafort, who is already in jail, may be in prison longer than planned. Last September, Manafort pled guilty to two reduced federal charges and agreed to cooperate with the special counsel investigating Russian interference in the 2016 election. Well, now Robert Mueller is alleging² that Manafort has been lying to his team, as well as to the FBI. And that would violate his plea deal. Let's bring in NPR's justice correspondent Carrie Johnson. Carrie, what exactly is the special counsel saying about Manafort at this point?

CARRIE JOHNSON, BYLINE³: Yeah, in a court filing last night, David, the special counsel said Manafort had committed new crimes by repeatedly lying to lawyers in the special counsel team and to the FBI in the course of his so-called cooperation. Remember. Paul Manafort pleaded guilty to two conspiracy⁴ charges in September, just a day before the jury was supposed to be selected for his trial in Washington, D.C. And as part of that process, Manafort agreed to full, voluntary and truthful⁵ cooperation with prosecutors⁶. They say he has breached⁷ that agreement, and they've had enough. And it's time for the judge to start the process of sentencing him - ultimately punishing Paul Manafort.

GREENE: So do Manafort's lawyers have any answer for these allegations?

JOHNSON: They say he's tried to live up to his part of the plea deal, that he's met numerous times with authorities in the last two months and that he does not believe he has not been truthful. This, they do agree with the special counsel team - it is time to start the machinery⁸ of sentencing going. They've asked Judge Amy Berman Jackson to order a sentencing - presentencing investigation⁹ report. And that will move the ball forward probably into early 2019.

GREENE: So he could be in even more legal trouble than before this plea deal if we're talking about possible additional crimes here.

JOHNSON: Indeed. You know, Paul Manafort can't seem to stay out of trouble. Remember, David, that after he had already been indicted¹⁰, they charged him again with alleged¹¹ witness tampering¹². Now there's this. He could face much stiffer prison time because of his alleged lies to the special counsel and the FBI. And he won't get any benefit from this cooperation, which authorities say was not true cooperation anyway. In fact, the judge may take into account the panoply¹³ of other criminal conduct he admitted as part of this plea deal and be stiffer with him. Remember. Paul Manafort's 69 years old. He's had some health problems already in jail. And he's facing much more than ten years - could now be more like 20 years in prison.

GREENE: So a lot of what he was charged with had to do with his time and his dealings with Ukraine. But obviously as campaign chairman, he might have known a lot of what was happening inside the Trump campaign - or wasn't happening. So I guess one question is could the special counsel have lost an important witness potentially here in the whole Russia investigation?

JOHNSON: The short answer, David, is we don't know. Remember. Paul Manafort was around in 2016 for that Trump Tower meeting with Jared Kushner, Donald Trump Jr. and a Russian lawyer. He also was around during the Republican National Convention when language in the party platform on Ukraine was watered down. He has a lot of things to say. He apparently¹⁴ was not saying them to authorities. And it's not clear how the special counsel is so confident that Paul Manafort has lied. Perhaps, they have some other secret information - still secret to us but not to them - that gives them a more full picture of what Russia did in 2016.

GREENE: OK, NPR justice correspondent Carrie Johnson joining us this morning. Thanks, Carrie.

JOHNSON: My pleasure.